Podcast Episode 5 – Moving Home in Divorce and Finding Your ‘Coorie’ Corner

Tosh is joined by ”The Rev’ Gail Love-Schock, an Interfaith Reverend and the world’s first and only Energy Transformation Strategist. She has helped thousands of people move through radical change, moving closer to love and celebration through meditation, ceremony, ritual, mentorship, and retreats.

Gail’s ministry focuses on the taboo subjects of life including sex, money and death, all of which enable people to live a rich, vibrant and meaningful life today.

Accredited by One Spirit Interfaith Foundation, she has featured in global outlets such as The Sunday Times, New York Post, The Sunday Post, and Psychologies.

I discovered Gail through an Instagram post on her 85 house moves (and she is about to do it again) I thought my 7 times in 7 years was good. I thought Gail must have valuable tips to help people feel less stressed when they move, especially after divorce.

She loves getting organised physically and mentally, spiritually and mentally and guides us through her thoughts, strategies and loving tips to support you through this difficult, challenging and often painful time.

In this episode :

I talk to Gail about what ‘Moving Home’ means to her and she shares her story.

We talk about the power of intention, the importance of a Coorie corner and why Gail believes every house should have one (at least).

We delve into how to face packing when you feel emotionally, physically and mentally depleted and why the act of ‘self-liking’ is important before we go for the ‘self-love’.

We talk about how we can reconnect back to ourselves through the most challenging and difficult times of our lives. Gail also shares her Moving Project and the importance of keeping it simple, keeping it moving and keeping it light.

She shares her wisdom with her wonderful Scottish humour in this magical episode. I hope you enjoy this and do reach out and share your thoughts.

You can find out what the very lovely Reverend Gail M Love-Schock is up to and what she offers at:

W: gailloveschock.com

IG: @gail_loveschock

You can sign up for her Something For The Weekend Newsletter

‘Business is wonderful because there’s gold dust in the air.’

You can find me at:

W: divorcegoddess.com

IG: @divorcegoddess

If you enjoyed this episode please share, review and subscribe it’s greatly appreciated.  I hope you enjoyed our conversation and do reach out to continue it.

Check out this episode!

Podcast Transcript

Hi, and welcome to Divorce Goddess®. So in this episode, I am so pleased to be talking to a really wonderful fascinating and just joyous lady about why it’s okay to move. Gail Love-Schock Interfaith Reverend and first and the only energy transformation strategist has helped thousands of people move through radical change, moving closer to love and celebration through meditation ceremony ritual mentorship and retreats. Gail’s ministry focuses on the taboo subjects of life including sex, money, and death and which enable people to live a rich vibrant and meaningful life today. She is accredited by one Spirit Interfaith Foundation, and she has been featured in global outlets such as the Sunday Times New York Post the Sunday post and Psychologies Magazine. So divorce, as our listeners will know kind of throws up all sorts for you and on average it involves a big house move, moving from family houses, perhaps moving due to a lack of money and really sort of finding their place in a very new world, and a very different world. And I’ve moved house just before my divorce and since I’ve moved seven times in as many years, and I kind of thought I had it down, and what caught my eye about Gail. Is she has moved house 85 times. Yeah, and as about to do it again. She loves getting organised and is here to guide you through her thoughts strategies and loving tips to support you through this difficult, challenging and often painful time. Hello Gail, thank you very much for joining us and for sharing your wisdom, and your lovely energy as well so where did your journey begin.

It’s such a, it’s such a rich question isn’t it. And for me personally, it was ultimately as a toddler, I slapped my little hands on my liittle thighs and said to my gran. Let’s get organised and she was like (laughing). And so, you know, that was the start over, a full life of ultimately always really having an understanding of space and place. So understanding what it meant for people to be in a space or in a place, and then the difference that can be created if, when we feel at home in our own bodies. So then the place the postcode that we live can become less important, it’s it’s a you know it is a place to put this sense of home, as it were, you know, to put the body as well so where the heart is. Yes yeah absolutely, absolutely, um, and that led me down all sorts of paths really so I was, you know, I was a cultural and development director working with local and national and international government for a really long time, and was also a high net worth, philanthropic fundraiser for a long time and always creating cultural infrastructure, ultimately, so if a new build went up, then, lots of other things had to go into that infrastructure, you know some people need places to go, they need, they need a hearth, as you know, and then in Scotland, we have a word Coorie, which means to cosy or to coorie and it’s like, the wee nook between you and the edge of the sofa where your kid or dog might try and squish itself ultimately. It’s about safety and sit on top of all the newspapers and magazines and all the firelighters and totally totally yeah so you know, for me, my work has always been about really the art of coorie which is the art of psychological safety, about helping people feel safe in themselves, and in where they spend their time. And then you know that has led me through all sorts of wonderful places and stages, and then into combining. You know my spirituality, my faith into my business and then working as an energy transformation strategist so again both where we live where we work, and in our bodies and becoming an interfaith minister. So as in being able to help people to step through what we might think of as those portals of transformation, and rightly as you say, some of which can be a wee bit more challenging than others.


It’s interesting isnt it that that whole sort of the energy around us you know and you talk about it and I kind of have people saying to me oh that’s bit woo woo or that’s a bit kind of out here but actually we all feel it we feel it when somebody walks into a room and we go. Oh my god, I just want to hang out with that person is they just have something about and have presence about them. And you know I think a lot of people feel that and then we’ll come to houses as well and they go, Oh, this feels really nice and those kind of get some people more than others get it, but you know that sense of walking in the somewhere and thinking, that’s home but it’s because it’s that awareness isn’t it. Absolutely, absolutely. And you know what you’re also, you know, touching upon there too is, is we’ve got all sorts of colloquialisms around what we might think of as the energy in a room so you could cut the atmosphere with a knife or the temperature just got chillier or an Oh my god, it was like a ray of sunshine when she walked in the room, you know, we talk about it all the time and absolutely having an awareness of it also helps us understand how, what we are feeling may have almost like music We each have a symphony, that orchestrates itself from us, and it’s why we feel safe for some people, unsafe with others. It’s why we choose to park our car in certain areas not others. These are all elements of instinct and intuitive ness and I would refer to them as being connected to, just to our inner selves to having trust to having faith in ourselves and in our decision making. And when we’re moving home, or when children are leaving home or when we’re going through divorce, trusting ourselves starts to get a little bit agitated. So our decision making can become a bit wobbly. And then also, that leads to things having a different feeling to them, which means we then have a different experience. And you know for me part of this is just that understanding about, you know, again, how am I feeling today. On a scale of one to 10. How do I feel about tackling these boxes, minus 75. And that might be because you actually have 75 boxes.

Yeah. And also that thing is like I do not want to have to make another decision like I cannot make another decision. Please don’t ask me to make another decision. You know, I just want somebody to come in and take this off my plate you know so there’s also an in, um, in we refer to them as levels of consciousness and the second level of consciousness is by me so this is when we really got into. It’s all up to me, everything falls on my shoulders well I’ll just get on with it really because nobody else is going to do it. I’m certainly not asking for help at that level. And I know the listeners will recognise this I do this to, you know, and, and often actually it’s the by me consciousness that can interrupt the original love of a relationship. It can interrupt the original harmony. So when you say by me You mean can you just explain that. so there is that sense of everything is being done by me. So it’s all up to me. Nobody else is going to do anything. So, to say that the level before that so level one of consciousness is to me. So these things are happening to me, and I am right outside of taking responsibility for that, and that’s that victim that’s that sort of an unkind expression which I wrestle when you know what I know it’s quite popular in America so you know that sort of pity party. We’ve all been there we’ve kind of gone all my goodness may and you just feel overwhelmed and especially if you kind of got like a really broken heart at the moment, and your children are wobbly because their homes about it, it’s, it’s, it’s understandable isn’t it.

So completely and you know it’s all, as we talk about as we will you know kind of these different levels of consciousness, these are really just another way of saying what mood Am I in today. You know what mood Am I in how am I feeling, you know, and then learnings and tools ultimately to move yourself to a different state or into a different frame of mind. absolutely I’ve certainly been in the ‘to me’ consciousness, and you know it’s to me I refer to it as like the emotional snakes and ladders, some days I’m trotting up that ladder and everything’s harmonious my smile is huge. Everything seems to have a level of synchronicity to and it’s all zing, zing, zing. (laughing)

You know, it’s like you to open the curtains and it’s like being in one of your favourite musicals, and then you know absolutely there’s other days when it can be really, really straightforward because of tiredness, because sometimes if not giving ourselves just a little bit of space to relax, what, and by the way I mean in the sense of doing nothing.

Self Care is it? And an even deeper than that i would i would exchange the word care for kindness. Yeah, no, I think if we start talking about self kindness we’re really starting to explore something different and again, particularly if it’s through Separation, Divorce, the grief that comes with that, that if somebody tells me I should go for some sort of massage or holistic therapy I’m probably going to stick two fingers up at them at that point I don’t talk to me about that, you know, I’m not interested. Even if it was my decision, you know, or even if it was the listeners decision that you know they’re the people that went actually this is complete, you know, but self kindness, like, literally, and I mean this like literally sitting down with a cup of tea and nothing else.

I kind of really like and this actually it really brought to mind that you know when you’re kind of in the middle of, like, in the middle of labour and somebody wants to like dab your brow and make it better, and all you want to say is, like, like, Don’t touch me. So when somebody says you are you should go for massage like what what are you talking about. , No, I haven’t got time.

No, no, and you couldn’t relax and also the last thing we really want is a stranger touching us. Yeah, you know, and it’s such an interesting thing I think also you know when we, when we talk about moving through divorce and we’re experiencing it and we’re supporting people. And, again, moving home, there can be all these essentially what I think other magazine layers of guidance which can talk about self care in inverted commas, whereas kindness, and an act of surrender, I might refer to it also is, is that sitting down for half an hour, you know, just and staring out the window, and just fully being with whatever is right there. I don’t know how to do this.

I can’t do another thing, and that’s okay, as well it’s not like you’ve failed, it’s just. No, it’s not like you’re even wasting time either because it’s almost like a little battery recharge isn’t it.

Well, you’re gaining time you’re gaining clarity and you know and then at some point possibly during that half an hour, hour it’s not for me to say how long that, and I’m using the word nothing but what I really need is no thing, you know, no thing, nobody, no one, no time. You know just giving, giving the mind, the absolute opportunity to un frazzle, even for a heartbeat. And then from that unfrazzled place then, then maybe get the notebook out you know half an hour later because you’ll have had some ideas, or I might refer to them as nudges or a wee thing will just run across your mind about single you should call you know who you should call you to call so and so. Oh, I forgot such and such, you know, so for me, one of the things at the moment is I’m selling a lot of furniture, moving a lot of things on, and I have two sewing machines which belongs to my gran and my gran passed, a few years ago and again there’s, we have this attachment to things – emotional attachment. Yeah, but you know she’s not in the sewing machine. Or if she is, I probably need some additional support.(laughing) Just get us sharing everything, without having to touch it. Like for me, it’s true.

When I moved, I literally just like on like the fourth or fifth move I’m lugging this stuff I’ll go Why on earth do you still have this stuff, what is it?

Because we’re so busy, and we’re on such a kind of gotta get this done and life’s busy and balancing everything else, especially as a single parent as well. You just have don’t feel like you have the headspace to, you know, look at things clearly which is why, as you said, rightly, said, giving yourself that time to do ‘no thing’ is I love that ‘no thing’.

Absolutely. And one of the things that happened for me and my no thing, you know, kind of space the other day was a friend that I know who you know ultimately works used to work in fashion and is now working in sustainable and style. Her name just again floated across my head so I just sent her a little email saying look, I’ve got these two sewing machines, I’m not moving them to Scotland. (laughing) And, you know, I just I have a feeling you might have a suggestion of where they might be able to go so that somebody gets really good use out of them. And I currently live in Worthing and sure enough she emailed me back later that day and said, a really good friend of mine has just started a woman’s project in Brighton here’s her number. I love that. I know I could have spent days thinking what’s the solution so this is by me consciousness, what’s the solution, what’s the solution, how do I do this how do I fix this, what do I have to do, but the No thing relaxation. I moved up a level into through me consciousness. So then the idea came through me, and then I was able to reach out and there was a solution in. Gosh, a 25th of the time, and I was energised by it as opposed to being drained by it and this is a really important distinction. When we are planning, ultimately a planned or an unplanned move, so you know again listeners might be thinking, I don’t have time to sit for half an hour not doing anything, but you will quadruple the time that you do have by giving yourself a wee bit of space every day again no thing. And recharging. Yeah absolutely.

Recharging your brain your you know your brain battery. And it’s weird because it’s those sort of I always call them the divorce mind monkeys, or any mind monkeys. They’re just waiting to sabotage you by going no no you can’t have this time half an hour seriously you could be doing something far better, and you feel yourself caught up in this, this, craziness and they are like yeah yeah yeah, go go go it do it do it and actually is doing you no good at all.

And that’s what you’re talking about, as well as it’s the difference between that emotional attachment and sort of falsified resilience, which is why you know we see so much burnout which is why we see exhaustion, which is why we see break down, as opposed to giving yourself the opportunity for a little bit more clarity for giving yourself a wee bit of space every day to remind yourself of the confidence that you’ve got and your decision making skills, and that you know this is such an important part of you know when when people are moving through divorce and separation because again, We might lose trust in ourselves, we might lose faith. Again, even if it’s a mutual decision, there is absolutely still grief and longing for what was there. So there’s totally a space to be able to honour, again, and, you know, make your to do list and then also I also talked about at the end of the day make you’re done and dusted lists as well. It’s not enough I don’t think to just take off the to do list because what we then do is we just write another to do list. But if I’ve got a notebook and on one side I’ve got my done and dusted list so everything that actually I did from the previous list, and all the other little things from the divorce mind monkeys, that actually if they came in and I tackled them and it is a tackle isn’t it. I’ve got Murrayfield currently and the rugby pitch. (laughing) I’ll take that yeah. (laughing).

And you know, and then I might my aides or my intentions or my to do list for the next day but the thing is on the left hand side of the notebook I can already see what I’ve actually achieved, it’s tangible. And then when I look at what’s to be done I’m like, Oh my gosh, look what happened. Look, this is going to be the same tomorrow. So then if I’ve got every day when I’m looking at my done and dusted, and then I’m looking at my to do, it means what I’m doing is I’m creating an intention the night before, to have at least a good day, maybe it’s even okay day. And then I’m meeting that intention and crossing the bridge with whatever I’m feeling whether that’s grief joy, anxiety, neglect separation fear discombobulation. Will it be okay if we have beans on toast for fourth tonight in a row that would when you know whatever it is, but then I can have a small celebration, each night when I looked at the done and dusted list, it’s, it’s a really really important part of mind care.

Yeah, I’m so with you and I think that’s the, you know, you’re so right about these two lists as well because you you so often forget, you know, everything you have done. And just, and actually not sort of honouring all the work and the time and the effort and whatever else you’ve put into sort of, you know, packing all those boxes, keeping your kids fed and doing their homework, while it’s happening, you know, not, not firing off at your ex perhaps because you know he’s not there emotionally for you anymore, which is like another huge kind of level of support that disappears, you know, and you’re kind of packing up the boxes on the road and it’s a real thing, a real thing so you’re, you’re absolutely right. To mention that as well. I love that. I was just gonna say the celebration probably not a bottle of wine. (laughing) The next day is gonna be really really tough.

I know I know and i think you know again, there’s something in that isn’t there to take a heartbeat take a breath, you know, just weigh out, the longer decision making process that you know there can be such immediacy, and that can be such a call for self soothing during these really interrupted times as well and so there may be a little bit of mothering of the self or fathering of the self that needs to go on, which absolutely booze or come into that stimulants will come into that and but, you know, know thyself ultimately, and you know what is really supportive to you, and just an honour that, you know, honour that whatever whatever feels good but know that you know tomorrow is another day and and booze is a, is there but also so is potentially the emotional hangover and then, you know, actually what you want to be is is attempting to nourish again and instil, a little bit of comfort to yourself again in those acts of self kindness, you know, using your tools and the way that you’re using them and, and again, yeah, we’re asking in that no thing there’s sometimes sitting with a you know a question which might be well okay what what is my part in this today. You know what’s my part in this today, or what’s the one thing I should I could do or, who’s a person I could reach out to that actually. Oh, I forgotten about so and so. Do you know what I always laugh when I speak with them. I’m going to give her a call. You know, so again this is having that kind of support squad I kind of talked about

quite a lot and my work about having a support squad so you have somebody you know see you know exactly who you can phone them why and they know what their role is. In you know, this whole break up in this time for you. So like your best joke person, you know, maybe need to read up on some jokes if I can’t find any, really good. Yeah, I mean, all of this so and kind of the there’s mastery activity So mindfulness, we call it a mastery activity. So doing something that you kind of know you got to do like carrying out a cupboard or something and packing that box up that you fear but actually feel so good afterwards as well. That’s absolutely what you’re, you’re saying is amazing. And, okay. So, how to manage a, was it what home is and it represents on every level, I kind of know that we’re touching an these questions. I’ve got for you

anyway very organically so

how would you with all your amazing experience how best, which you create a safe and nurturing and joyous environment quickly, even if it’s temporary and that’s kind of important.

I love that. It sort of circles is back to this Scottish art of coorie really so I would really encourage everybody to have a coorie corner, or what we might think of as a safe nook. So even if it’s a chair, a blanket and reading lamp somewhere that just is right there, safe harbour, the anchor, you know, the kids will pick up on it really quickly you probably find them there. Similarly, if you have pets. The dog will take to that corner right away. Anybody that’s my seat, you know. No, no, no, no tiny human. And so, a coorie corner, really important. And again, ensure our basic needs are taken care of in that you know so it was space is temporary, it can still be home because we’re in our body, and our body is our permanent home. And so it comes down to those acts of kindness as well that there is an interrupted space that there is least somewhere that isn’t, full of boxes or clutter and, and also there’s a, you know, the kind of psychology around the unpacking and packing, it’s just know that if it’s a bridge and it’s a really temporary space that it can often be super worthwhile to put things into storage, even if it feels like it’s another little bit of an expenditure, but it’s an expanse of choice for you to feel safe in in where you are, or to ask friends if they have guaranteed space or loft space or something like that so that, again, you’re not necessarily having to take everything with you

as well. Again, sorry all

that overwhelm as well of looking at it all and

sort of clutter almost.

Yeah, absolutely, absolutely, and it can, you know, a wall of boxes can be like a wall of boxes, ultimately, it can be a very dominant expression of things still to do. And again, if we’re not feeling incredibly rested, or nourished or connected to joy, ultimately, at this point in time at this point in the, in the ride of life, then yeah those physical representations of change, absolutely can be a little bit overpowering. So again in the ‘no thing’ ness in the relaxation state. There will be solutions and people in places that will literally spring to mind about how to help but I would always encourage a coorie corner, obviously children’s spaces as well to be to be taken care of, and indeed your sleeping space also often the kids and the animals and everybody else can get put you know before, before the adults and that’s absolutely part of it but also the bedroom is not a storage area clean bedding sounds really simple, clean bedding. And, again, things that bring comfort, you know, if you’re going through grief and there’s elements that are supportive to you then also just ensure there is that endless box of tissues, because they’re going to be needed. You know, just take care of yourself in that way, and rescue remedy. Yes and rescue remedy Yes. Yeah. And if you do yeah absolutely use anything that you work with its therapy oil or if you use, my children used to have like the Bach remedies or whatever you call them and they

actually just go in and just help themselves depending on how they’re feeling but I was going to say it’s interesting about the bedroom because the bedroom for me was my safe place. We used to call it the mothership yes my children were just coming onto the mothership and the sort of the mother, nurturing space. And that was a really important part for us as well.

Absolutely, and a very very basic thing in amongst creating safe space, even if it’s temporary is the easiest way to clear a space is to open a window. Yeah. Lovely. It’s, we often think of in my line of work through ceremony and ritual it can become very convoluted and complicated because people think the harder you work at something, the better the outcome. Whereas again and I think it’s got something to do with being Scottish I’ll open the window before I would even think about burning sage, for example, which is an ancient and modern, and part of clearing space. However, our homes don’t need it, burning Sage these days can be a bit like throwing bleach all over the house it’s a very different as only a wee bit that’s needed so if anybody’s working with Sage I mean some people might be like why would I Why would I like what I put on the Sunday dinner this just sounds completely bonkers. You know, and you’re right it is. And, but you know it has a ultimately the smoke that comes from the sage interrupts the atomic setup ultimately in our air, and it can change what’s happening around us so it just, you know. I

had a line manager who said to me somebody was talking about sage, or I went something like oh. I know about that, and. And basically you just burn sage and she said, Oh, if ever, my husband and I have an argument she said I always just burn a little bit of sage in the room and it just seems to clear it like wow get you I love that and everybody was like, Oh, that’s a good idea. Yes, sage and we kind of get Sage from lots of different places can’t we so

as you rightly said, burning a little bit and it just,

it just sort of seems to sort of sweep,

any of the negativity and bad words out and actually sort of, I used to do it, if my Ex and I ever had to have a meeting and a house or in our house or home and afterwards if it got kind of got a bit heated which, you know, it’s kind of tough. It’s hard not to have good meetings all the time. I would open the window I would just burn a little bit of sage and just shoo any other words out that needed, not to stay the room.

Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely and again there’s something because it’s a purposeful action, that’s also part of why it has that power to wanted a better word, and we’ve chosen the action to have lighting. You know that particular for plan, so therefore we also have an expectation that it will do something if that makes sense and so that intention and that intentionality that brought into everything for example, you know today i’m gonna i’m going to pack three boxes. And then you pack three boxes, you know, it’s the same intent you expect it to happen so it happens and that’s a really really important part of that creating the mothership as your calling it. I expect this space to be safe my intention is that the children will feel safe here. And so they do, and so they do because that’s how you set it up. And that’s the really really important part again of us recreating trust in ourselves and our decision making process, in our capability as a parent,

because that carpet really properly, it gets taken out from underneath you you know you. I can every level you’re sort of like as always I always kind of liken it to like a Tetris floor like things drop away, they’re not as they seem any more, you know, disappearing down rabbit hole and you’re just. And you kind of already find that within yourself that like find your inner strength and people go I cant I havent anything left inside me, and it comes back to your lovely. You know, you all no thing time about having recharging time as well so

we also want to have some sort of anchor. Obviously as well through divorce, essentially jewellery is also one of the things that change so rings that might have been worn for a very long time or even pieces of jewellery that were given as gifts, or all sorts of things. And, but it can be really helpful to think of a piece as an anchor so if you see it, you can be reminded that you’ve got this.

I’m wearing my ring, I just started wearing it about a week ago, how amazing you just said that amazing what was given to me, like, I had it made, and I’m middle one, and then the round one that my children are like the little square ones when each side. And it’s like, yeah, it’s like this anchor, I

never thought of it like that lovely. Yeah,

yeah. And that, and it could also be in Scotland, and Celtic lineage, we have the thing. We also have things known as oathing stones which are. So sometimes. I always end up when I’m yesterday even I put a winter coat on I hadn’t worn since last year and in it, there was a stone and I don’t know where I picked up from but somewhere but I’ll have picked it up and there’s a sense of rubbing it will be in connection with it again it’s just an, it’s an anchor that it’s in my pocket and when it’s there I’m just reminded…

So is that like you are going for a walk and finding like a piece of flint or something or a smooth stone and thinking ohhh. It’s quite grounding isn’t it that sort of

briefly. Yeah. And then for me there is a wee bit I would always ask if I could take it you know we as humans, we shoplift from nature all the time. (laughing)

I never thought of it like that but it’s true.

I have to go through all my coat pockets now and have a little like rummage and find

Last years tissue,  and bring and I always remember my my ,mum, getting,

I’m sure she’ll forgive me for saying this but getting a tissue out of her pocket when we

were younger and you’re like oh my god. Like,

  1. Exactly exactly (laughing)

So, um, I just wanted, so you have something called a moving project. I just want you, if you can tell us, and our listeners about about your work, and the moving project – which I love the sound of.

Yeah so well it’s my personal moving project so it is move 86. (laughing)

So much respect to you. thank you thank you

And it’s so wonderful. Because it isn’t. And I think this is important for people to hear it isn’t something I would have historically spoken about because again you’re just in it and you’re moving and you’re, you’re doing what you’re doing. And, but yeah the moving project is very much about ultimately helping us move, you know, move house but it can also help us move house without moving house, so actually that you just you want to clear in a slightly different way so I’m certainly not taking kind of like a Marie Kondo approach to this but I’m also not taking a let’s just absolutely bin everything and then become minimalists, unless either of those things are completely are tickling your fancy, but for me it’s really about you know how to have a stress free move, stay sane and also monetize some of what you might no longer want to keep. And there is a strange thing also that I find in moving home, Gumtree, I absolutely love that I bought many beautiful pieces and so many beautiful pieces. Because actually, it is a huge community, and you just meet the most bonkers people that you would never come into contact with

the extra isnt it?

Yeah, and it’s just, it’s just this thing also of the Mr. You know, often it’s easier to speak to a stranger, so whatever you’re feeling you know if somebody says you know kind of why are you selling or why, why are you buying or whatever, you can just tell them exactly what’s going on because you’ll only see them for about five and a half minutes, and then also go and you’ll never see them again, (laughing)

But actually you all exchange storys as well, like, you know, I remember I sold some my pieces and actually you just reminded me about gumtree being a great place because I have a couple of other things but

I do remember when somebody asked me I think if I was having a really tough day and I think I just went.

Yeah. And they just gave me, this stranger just gave me the biggest hug, and he just said, he just said it, it’ll be okay and you know what.? That was such an extraordinary experience that I wasn’t banking on. And I felt so much better,

the random kindness of strangers. Oh gosh, absolutely, because really we are all connected, you know, and we are all family and it can, we can feel very isolated, you know, during divorce or loss and so again the moving project is this is practising as my Buddhist teacher friend would say detachment, but if you are in that level of consciousness which is to me and you think things are happening to you or your by me consciousness and you think you have to do everything to get everything done, you’re not going to be able to practice detachment, it’s going to be the same feeling as somebody telling you to go and get a massage you’re just going to want to put two fingers up to the whole thing, you know. So, I think you know the moving project is for me. Again, it begins with how I’m feeling. So when I put my plan together when I’m working with clients on this as well. You know I really want them to get into this idea of what a five star move would feel like the feeling of it. And even if you haven’t felt those feelings for a while or you’re not sure that you’re supposed to feel those feelings because also in grief, Joy can bubble up and sometimes we can feel a little, a little bit guilty about that. So we want to be really honest about the fact that there is opportunity, there is possibility, we do have potential that something will come from this burning, ultimately, as it can often feel, you know, this is, this is divorce I often think of. It’s like when the farmers set their grounds alight you know they burn off the end of the, of the wheat ultimately because the land has to us we grow and it can only do that once everything has gone, and we forget that we too is part of nature sometimes go through that burning as well oh just got many goose bumpily as you were saying that actually.Yeah, that’s a lovely thing

definitely. Yeah,

yeah. So I think, you know, get it, get it buddy get a friend, you know, get some big bits of paper get the kids involved you know what is a five star move look like – that is really important, because I think when it so often as sort

of single parents are kind of going, Oh my God, my children can be so impacted by this they’re going to be so upset about this they’re going to be really kind of the actually when children feel involved and part of the process, that is, theyre learning really good life skills, ready for when they do move and you’re kind of, you know, the old as I’m finding out now my daughter at University, and they just a totally yeah they love it, they feel like they’re part of something rather than feeling like, oh, we’re just sort of floating around, you know,

and sort of in space nowhere with no purpose and everybody needs purpose. Absolutely,

absolutely. And what I know to be true is that when when loved ones work together in this way, everybody has a stake in the outcome. I love that. So, everybody is so much more ready to take responsibility because then you’re not in to me consciousness a kid isn’t going to feel like a mom or dad or telling you what to do again No, I don’t want to pack this box, you know they’re gonna understand. Oh, hang on, wait my part in this is just to keep bringing me to the table. I mean they won’t get it in those terms necessarily but you know they’ll just understand, you know, if we’ve got prepubescent adolescent or pre GCSE children who are moving through this invite them into a safe space to also share what they don’t want to feel, because sometimes we have to talk about that first, sometimes we have to talk about the minus 75 feelings that we don’t want any more first. And once we’ve got that down on paper, then you can move to the second sheet and be like okay well what is the five star feelings, what are we looking forward to. But again it just you know there is for me again the art of coorie. The Art of creating safe spaces, the, the art of ritual to help people move through generally all happens around the table. Generally there will be breaking bread food, tea, you know, a glass of wine, there’ll be something that just gets everybody ultimately sitting shoulder to shoulder as opposed to people again feeling as if it’s them being told, or someone feeling that they have to tell or lead. So then, not shared ownership and it’s about, you know, shared expansion, and then this is us moving into through me consciousness, and then into that fourth place which is known as as me consciousness. So, you know, and you’re just getting ideas, all the time, you’re really trusting your instincts you’ve you found your faith again you trust yourself you’re confident, you’re competent you have transitioned and transformed and actually instead of being in worry, you’re kind of more in warrior at times and you’re like, you’ve got this,

we all need a bit of warrior that’s less the worrier, and the warrior more of the warrior, and the proper owning, you know you’re enough. Yes, yes, yes, yes, absolutely amazing and actually sort of, you know, divorce is so empowering. Change the way you know you’re looking at it and you’ve actually you know want and all these amazing like thoughts and tips you’ve kind of like talked about today, it’s just really builds that foundation for this warrior, I love that warrior. Totally love that thank you I love your moving project I think that’s just incredibly helpful for people because I know people get so scared about moving house. I remember we looked, I would have loved you the first time I moved my family home. Just because, yeah, it was a painful process.

Okay, so I just want to talk to us about about where are you moving to next you’re eighty sixth move. Laughter

Yeah, I didn’t know and knowing that it won’t be the last as well. Oh, I love that you know.

Absolutely. Um, so moving to Scotland moving to Argylle and Bute basically live, live by a loch, which is going to be wonderful and moving into a really old property built in 1750, and having had various iterations and now, now housing 18 apartments, ultimately, so I just took them. I’ve just got lots of sort of tinklyness in my tummy about looking forward to sort of bonkers Sherry parties at Christmas and things like that and all these different amazing kind of characters all sharing space together,

yes yeah so so much fun they’re being closer to family and you know it’s been a long time since I’ve lived in Scotland so that’s going to be really lovely and yearn being closer to nature as well and you know part of the moving project for me was actually, you know, I also used to be a luxury producer. So I work with a lot of them, a lot of big brands you know Lamborghini graff diamonds opening hotels travelling the world, London Fashion Week, etc. And part of the ritual for me in the moving project has also been actually selling or moving on, you know, pieces that I just want where I do not need Jimmy Choo shoes to run around and lock him What am I going to do with those that’s just not going to happen you know you’re sherry party. That’s true, that’s true. You must, maybe keep one pair for the party.

There’s a balance. Actually, and, you know, there’s also there’s also a grief for the woman that I was in the woman who thought these, you know that this armor in a way, to a certain extent, was really necessary so. Also, it’s, it’s having a profound effect on me personally in terms of my own experience in the world and actually it’s just, it’s become a pleasure to to sell things that I might have moved again but I just can’t, it’s become an annoying pleasure to shred paperwork thats over a decade all that I really don’t need to move anymore. (laughing) It’s a meet up and

I think we need to get a list for you to go on like a PDF or something with your five top tips and then everyone can get your information, and that would be amazing. I just, it’s really interesting actually because one of the big things is you’re moving from a family home you’re moving from like lots lots of parties and you know that there are not that many parties out there for divorcees I think is probably the general sort of consensus, certainly in my group. And I remember selling all these beautiful silk lovely like Diane Von Furstenberg dresses and they’re my dinner party dresses and I remember holding them and thinking Crikey I was so miserable wearing these dresses. And I was so sad. And I remember arguments that happened I was wearing these dresses and I just thought I’m going to get them off with love, I’m going to sell them. And with that, I’m going to maybe buy something, you know some lovely bed linen or something? Yes.

It’s so important. It’s so important and also again for our children. It is an extraordinary victory emblem of leadership for children to watch, living transformation. And then when the dinner parties come around again, you know when the supper parties come around again for then the joy and the pleasure of going out and making a conscious purchase for the man or the woman, or the person that you are today. And there’s a real tenderness in that.

I know it’s really kind of really acknowledging who you are, and. ActuallyI dont think I want whether it doesn’t matter what what they are where they’re from, but it was actually I’m just not that person you’re so right actually having some fun, the new year as well. Like I said to a client the other day as I just said I said, you need to put some buy some really great red pants are really good for that kind of energy send you a low energy centre and just go wherever and she’s okay yes.

Absolutely. And you remind me actually a few years ago I went through what I called the reclamation projects, forever got a big project. And, and actually red underwear was a huge part of that to reclaim it from what it might be considered, and ultimately just to claim the colour, again, and to claim redness and to yeah with the energy centres to you know red knickers on you know kind of on your bumb just brilliant, you’re only going to feel good. And God willing, you’re going to be feeling a little bit naughty as well.

Really important.

We want you to feel you know kind of been to get that little that little bit of joy, but almost like back on your bum again.

The mischief, you will really feel that there’s a wee bit of mischief and jiggle that’s welcome and a little bit of magic and, and also there’s something as well about the great mystery of not knowing what will be. And again, if I’m moving through those levels of consciousness and I can, I can be in through me consciousness. I can sit with nothing for a little bit every day, then that mystery is going to talk to me a little bit more than I might have been available for. It’s sort of like being on a date with the unknown every day, and then yeah, that’s exciting. That is exciting, isn’t it, because I guess and.

But you know this that divorce part of me going Crikey, everything was unknown at the moment but actually it’s so true. You have to be with it you have to let go of the sort of the control the inner control freakery that wants to jump in because you feel so out of control, you want to control and actually just as you say just be open to.

And I think my final little tip that I would say just around this is, is also rage is a huge component of what people are experiencing moving through these transformations. And, and it’s really important to allow that to have somewhere to express itself as well. So again for myself, sort of coming out of what was the reclamation project for me the bridge between reclamation and moving. And I ended up going to a Dojo. So, and and walking in and basically just saying to the, to the dojo master. I’m full of rage and I’m really frightened I’m going to hurt somebody or myself. I need to do something with this just confirm what a dojo is. Also, a basically a training House of martial arts, I think, Oh, okay. So, so then I found myself, three times a week ending up on in the dojo, and basically learning from a karate sensei mixed martial arts, and just moving through the belt, and gain process through the accumulation of skills, and again the ritual, the respect the equality, because there was little children, me, people in their 60s and 70s, all in the training room at the same time all in the dojo at the same time, there was something really important about that for me to understand the power of when we’re feeling violent, the power when we’re feeling rage and what happens if it absolutely has a laser focus and how much clarity and safety that can create. So, if people are feeling angry I would say, have a look for local boxing gyms, or a local martial arts place or. There’s a reason jujitsu is very very popular with men. And we’ve seen a massive increase in that in the last five years. So, find somewhere that you can go and openly say I’m experiencing this, I’m really angry. I’d like to do something with it. Because what will ultimately happen is somehow, you will develop new skills, the anger will diminish, you’ll become healthier, you’ll become a more solidified person of yourself, and what can be quite a quirky community that you might never spend time with other ones will become some of your greatest allies. So, I would really encourage you to look to those spaces and places as well.

Rather than throwing a load of lovely crockery at your ex. Yes. I had it replaced today.


I’m finding a straight road, not a little country windy road, and just screaming your head off. Absolutely, absolutely to the dojo. Yeah, absolutely, absolutely but yes find somewhere to expel that ultimately and rage is really important, particularly in the West we shy away from it as an emotion, but it is hugely transformative and again, think about that fire burning the fields, this is, this is your transformation, and you can you can let it happen to you. So that to me consciousness, or you can let it go through you. And then again, this allows an extraordinary transformation, which will take time. And I think that’s really important to acknowledge, but there will come a point when you are healed and you will know the day you will wake up and you will know the day and you’ll be like,

Oh my god, I’m definitely getting goose bumps. Now, it’s that like finding your Green Valley it’s like I always thought that journey walking over furrows and some days you’ll boots away down by sticking mud. Other days, the mud just gets kicked off and it’s okay. And all the time it’s finding. I have just I love talking to you I could talk to you for another hour (laughter) and a very long podcast, but you are Please come back on this podcast, Id love to. I would love to talk to you about so many other aspects as well which would be amazingly helpful for our listeners, and their process of moving forward moving on regaining confidence and and healing as well we’re going to put the healing word out there it’s a little bit scary for some people but ultimately, it is about sort of healing these wounds so you can move forward in life and you know not have this stuff drag you down.

Yeah. Thank you. Good luck with your move. And maybe we can like talk when you’ve moved and you and your lovely Sherry parties with your beautiful shoes on. I love that. Yeah, it’s not just about all your wonderful wonderful sort of compatriots living near the loch it sounds just totally beautiful I spent a lot of my childhood in the highlands so for me, I’m hearing you and I’m like, Oh, I need to get back there.

Yeah, yeah,

Thank you. Gail Love-Schock and love your name by the way is just best name ever. Thank you so much for your time and all your wisdom. And, yeah, just, you know, your energy, everything being here. Thank you.

Thank you.